<div dir="ltr"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">Hi Jorn,<br></blockquote><div> Thanks for your response . It is Within subjects experiments design. The result remains same because the design doesn't change . They are only just different expression on the source statistic comparing to sensor statistic on group level on FT tutorial. </div>
<div> In my data, the cluster randomization picks something funny and doesn't make sense while the difference plots is more informative and more consistent with the topos. Technically speaking - the cluster randomization does not test for location , but only if there is a difference or not - thus the clusters should be interpreted with caution. Therefore , I think about trying another statistic method as well although cluster randomization is wildly used within donders institute . Do you have any suggestion? </div>
<div style> Best,</div><div style> Haiteng</div><div> </div><div class="gmail_extra">
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 19 April 2013 11:35, <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:fieldtrip-request@science.ru.nl" target="_blank">fieldtrip-request@science.ru.nl</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
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</blockquote><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">Today's Topics:<br>
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1. Re: Source statistic doesn't match grand average difference<br>
at all and prior knowledge (J?rn M. Horschig)<br>
<br><br></blockquote><div style><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 1<br>
Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2013 11:35:44 +0200<br>
From: "J?rn M. Horschig" <<a href="mailto:jm.horschig@donders.ru.nl">jm.horschig@donders.ru.nl</a>><br>
To: FieldTrip discussion list <<a href="mailto:fieldtrip@science.ru.nl">fieldtrip@science.ru.nl</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [FieldTrip] Source statistic doesn't match grand average<br>
difference at all and prior knowledge<br>
Message-ID: <<a href="mailto:51710FF0.5040904@donders.ru.nl">51710FF0.5040904@donders.ru.nl</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; Format="flowed"<br>
<br>
Dear Haiteng,<br>
<br>
I think in the example the design matrix is wrongly computed. If you<br>
compare the single and the group-level example, it is described exactly<br>
the same, which does not make much sense. Afaik it should be this<br>
instead (analogue to freq statisics on group level):<br>
<br>
/subj = numel(sourceA.trial);<br>
design = zeros(2,2*subj);<br>
for i = 1:subj<br>
design(1,i) = i;<br>
end<br>
for i = 1:subj<br>
design(1,subj+i) = i;<br>
end<br>
design(2,1:subj) = 1;<br>
design(2,subj+1:2*subj) = 2;<br>
/<br>
Let me know if this makes things better (not in today, working from<br>
home, so better reply to this lis).<br>
<br>
Best,<br>
J?rn<br>
<br>
On 4/19/2013 10:25 AM, Haiteng Jiang wrote:<br>
> Hi FTer,<br>
> I am doing Cluster-based permutation statistic after<br>
> beamforming on two condition over subjects following the tutorial<br>
> <a href="http://fieldtrip.fcdonders.nl/example/source_statistics" target="_blank">http://fieldtrip.fcdonders.nl/example/source_statistics</a>, but I get<br>
> something funny.<br>
> In my case , I would expect decreased activity in the visual and<br>
> posterior area. The effect is quite strong, which is showed in the<br>
> grand average difference (log ratio to reduce inter subject<br>
> variability). However , from the statistic , the identified areas<br>
> go to the temporal area , which doesn't make sense at all . Please<br>
> see the below and attached pictures. I understand cluster-based<br>
> permutation test doesn't necessary pick the peak difference, but in<br>
> general it should find main different area. Any comment would be<br>
> greatly appreciated.<br>
><br>
> Average:<br>
><br>
> Inline images 2<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Statistic:<br>
> Inline images 1<br>
> Best,<br>
> Haiteng<br>
><br>
> --<br>
> Haiteng Jiang<br>
> PhD candidate<br>
> Neuronal Oscillations Group<br>
> Donders Institute for Brain, Cognition and Behaviour<br>
> Centre for Cognitive Neuroimaging<br>
> Radboud University Nijmegen<br>
><br>
> Visiting address<br>
> Room 2.32<br>
> Donders Centre for Cognitive Neuroimaging<br>
> Kapittelweg 29<br>
> 6525 EN Nijmegen<br>
> the Netherlands<br>
><br>
> Tel.: <a href="tel:%2B31%20%280%29243668291" value="+31243668291">+31 (0)243668291</a><br>
> Web: <a href="https://sites.google.com/site/haitengjiang/" target="_blank">https://sites.google.com/site/haitengjiang/</a><br>
><br>
><br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
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<br>
<br>
--<br>
J?rn M. Horschig<br>
PhD Student<br>
Donders Institute for Brain, Cognition and Behaviour<br>
Centre for Cognitive Neuroimaging<br>
Radboud University Nijmegen<br>
Neuronal Oscillations Group<br>
FieldTrip Development Team<br>
<br>
P.O. Box 9101<br>
NL-6500 HB Nijmegen<br>
The Netherlands<br>
<br>
Contact:<br>
E-Mail: <a href="mailto:jm.horschig@donders.ru.nl">jm.horschig@donders.ru.nl</a><br>
Tel: <a href="tel:%2B31-%280%2924-36-68493" value="+31243668493">+31-(0)24-36-68493</a><br>
Web: <a href="http://www.ru.nl/donders" target="_blank">http://www.ru.nl/donders</a><br>
<br>
Visiting address:<br>
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End of fieldtrip Digest, Vol 29, Issue 36<br>
*****************************************<br>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div><div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Haiteng Jiang</font></div><div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">PhD candidate</font></div><div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Neuronal Oscillations Group</font></div>
<div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Donders Institute for Brain, Cognition and Behaviour</font></div><div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Centre for Cognitive Neuroimaging</font></div><div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Radboud University Nijmegen</font></div>
<div><span style="line-height:18px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br></font></span></div><div><span style="line-height:18px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Visiting address</font></span></div>
<div><div style="text-align:left;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><div><span style="line-height:18px"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Room 2.32</font></span></div><div><span style="line-height:18px"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Donders Centre for Cognitive Neuroimaging</font></span></div>
<div><span style="line-height:18px"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Kapittelweg 29</font></span></div><div><span style="line-height:18px"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">6525 EN Nijmegen</font></span></div>
<div><span style="line-height:18px"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">the Netherlands</font></span></div><div><span style="line-height:18px"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br></font></span></div></div>
</div><div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"> Tel.: +31 (0)243668291</font></div></div><div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"> Web: <a href="https://sites.google.com/site/haitengjiang/" target="_blank">https://sites.google.com/site/haitengjiang/</a></font></div>
</div></div>