There is a formula in the NetStation-manual: (5000 mircovolts / (2^16 bits).<br>You can convert bits to microvolts by multiplicating all signals with the factor <span style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">0,076293945</span> in fieldtrip.<br>
This solution isn't perfect, because it doesn't consider gains.<br>We asked EGI for an other formula, but didn't yet get an answer.<br>I compare the two methods and for little N the gains don't make a great difference.<br>
<br><br>Best,<br>Daria<br><br><br><br><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2012/9/13 Matt Mollison <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:matt.mollison@gmail.com" target="_blank">matt.mollison@gmail.com</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div>Daria,</div><div><br></div>I do not know any calibration function for raw files that were exported without calibration, but maybe it is a simple formula? You might want to contact EGI. Let us know if you find anything out.<div>
<br></div><div>Best,</div><div class="im"><div>Matt<br><br clear="all">--<br>Univ. of Colorado at Boulder<br>Dept. of Psychology and Neuroscience<br><a href="mailto:matthew.mollison@colorado.edu" target="_blank">matthew.mollison@colorado.edu</a><br>
<a href="http://psych.colorado.edu/~mollison/" target="_blank">http://psych.colorado.edu/~mollison/</a></div></div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div><div class="h5">On Thu, Sep 13, 2012 at 1:21 AM, Daria Laptinskaya <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:daria.laptinskaya@googlemail.com" target="_blank">daria.laptinskaya@googlemail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
</div></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div class="h5">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Yes, it
works fine now-thank you!!!</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">@Matt: Do
you know a calibration-function for existing raw-files?</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Best,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Daria</span></p></div></div><div><div>
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2012/9/10 Joseph Dien <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jdien07@mac.com" target="_blank">jdien07@mac.com</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div style="word-wrap:break-word"><div><div class="h5"><div>Hey Daria,</div><div> glad you were able to get it worked out! Thank Matt for his reminder (below) about the calibration option.</div><div><br></div><div>Cheers!</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Joe</div><p class="MsoNormal"></p><br><blockquote type="cite"><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Hi Joe,</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><br></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">I didn’t know that there is a function like this.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">The most of my colleagues use the RAW.-files they get from the file-exporter without problems.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Not even NetStation-support could give me an answer.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">So I thought, it must be a problem between NetStation and fieldtrip.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Because of your tip I opened an original datafile and tried to save a copy of the file.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Doing so NetStation offers a possibility to ‘convert to microvolts’ and create a .ses –datafile.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">The .raw-files I get this way have microvolt as unit.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">I compared the signals I get this way with the signals I get by using the formula (5000 mircovolts / (2^16 bits) I send you. They are almost the same-that’s great!!!</span></p><p class="MsoNormal">
<span lang="EN-US">It seems to work now.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Thank you very much!!! You were a great help!!!</span></p><div><span lang="EN-US"> </span><br></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Cheers,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Daria</span></p></blockquote></div></div><div><div><div><div><div class="h5"><div>On Sep 6, 2012, at 9:07 PM, Joseph Dien <<a href="mailto:jdien07@mac.com" target="_blank">jdien07@mac.com</a>> wrote:</div>
<br></div></div><blockquote type="cite"><div style="word-wrap:break-word"><div><div class="h5"><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Helvetica,sans-serif">I don't recall ever seeing this problem with EGIS files, which is one of the reasons I prefer using this file format despite EGI's preference for newer Simple Binary format, but it's an unpredictable bug so I can't say it can't happen. I also can't say which versions of NetStation it happens with. It may have been fixed. I'm still trying to test out MFF so can't say anything about it. I had problems with the FieldTrip code for reading segmented MFF files (which is what I'm interested in). I also had trouble with writing them out from NetStation so I don't have a valid segmented test file and I'm still waiting for EGI to make one available so I can work them out. The simple binary file format (this is the original name for the EGI .raw file format and I prefer to use it over ".raw" as the BESA .raw file format is actually the .egis file format so it can get confusing) doesn't actually have separate calibration information for the channels (unlike EGIS), just one single gain value and no zeros values. So basically the simple binary format makes the assumption that calibration corrections have already been performed prior to generating the file. My understanding is that this is indeed what the "calibrate data" option is doing, but you'd have to confirm with EGI.</span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Helvetica,sans-serif"><br></span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Helvetica,sans-serif">Joe</span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Helvetica,sans-serif"><br>
</span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Helvetica,sans-serif"><br></span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------</div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><br></div></div></div><div><div><div class="h5"><div>
On Sep 6, 2012, at 1:01 PM, Matt Mollison <<a href="mailto:matt.mollison@gmail.com" target="_blank">matt.mollison@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div>
<br></div></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div class="h5">Joe,<div><br></div><div>A few related questions:</div><div><br></div><div>Does using the "calibrate data" option when exporting to raw (simple binary) correct for gain? Or is there a different solution/recommendation?</div>
<div>Does exporting to MFF (Net Station 4.5.x only) or EGIS have this issue? I tend to use EGIS (faster to read than raw) and have no recollection of seeing unusually large voltages.<br><br>Thanks,</div><div>Matt</div>
</div></div><div><br><div><div class="h5"><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Sep 5, 2012 at 7:17 PM, Joseph Dien <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jdien07@mac.com" target="_blank">jdien07@mac.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div style="word-wrap:break-word"><div>The Simple Binary (.raw) files don't get corrected for gain when imported (I helped write them). I've experienced occasional unpredictable bugs with NetStation export routines where the files are generated with amplitudes many times too large, even with text format files. It's a bit disconcerting to say the least. I could take a look at your files if you'd like confirmation.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Joe</div><div><div><br><div><div>On Sep 4, 2012, at 4:00 PM, Ingrid Nieuwenhuis <<a href="mailto:inieuwenhuis@BERKELEY.EDU" target="_blank">inieuwenhuis@BERKELEY.EDU</a>> wrote:</div>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
Hi Daria,<br>
<br>
Also, did you try looking at your raw data (so before the ERPs are
made) in FieldTrip and in Net Station? So open your .raw data in
NetStation. You can just look at a random participant's data, and
check if the scale is the same. I'm pretty sure no amplification
takes place when reading in the data into FieldTrip, this check can
confirm that. Hope this helps, and let us know what you find.<br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
Ingrid<br>
<br>
<br>
<div>On 9/3/2012 1:35 PM, Robert Oostenveld
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">Hi Daria,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>There might indeed be an incompatibility in the gain value
applied to the data.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>If you are able to export the data using the EGI software in
another format (e.g. EDF), you could read them both into
FieldTrip and compare the timecourse aplitudes to check whether
they are different. In case they are, I suggest to involve EGI
support. They are aware of the FieldTrip reading functions and
will know much more about the internals of their various file
formats.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>best regards</div>
<div>Robert</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On 3 Sep 2012, at 17:22, Daria Laptinskaya wrote:</div>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">Dear Fieldtrippers,<br>
<br>
I analysed EGI-data (.raw-files, NetStation 4.3.) with the
fieldtrip toolbox. <br>
The ERPs look perfect. <br>
The 'only' problem is, that my signals look to strong.<br>
It looks like if I get amplitutes (average) until 70 <span>µ</span>V.
<br>
I think it must be an intern amplifier for the signals.<br><p class="MsoNormal"><span>Does anyone know this problem
with EGI-data?</span></p><p class="MsoNormal">Or does anyone know, where I can see
the amplifier?<br>
</p><p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<span></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span><br>
</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span>Greetings,</span></p>
<span>Daria</span>
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<br>
<pre cols="72">--
Ingrid Nieuwenhuis PhD
Postdoctoral Fellow
Sleep and Neuroimaging Laboratory
Department of Psychology
University of California, Berkeley
California 94720-1650
Tolman Hall, room 5305</pre>
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<a href="mailto:fieldtrip@donders.ru.nl" target="_blank">fieldtrip@donders.ru.nl</a><br>
<a href="http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/fieldtrip" target="_blank">http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/fieldtrip</a><br></div></div></blockquote></div> <br></div>
<br>_______________________________________________<br>
fieldtrip mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:fieldtrip@donders.ru.nl">fieldtrip@donders.ru.nl</a><br>
<a href="http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/fieldtrip" target="_blank">http://mailman.science.ru.nl/mailman/listinfo/fieldtrip</a><br></blockquote></div><br>